Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORPG

Novus Aeterno discussions; what more needs to be said?

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Nick » Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:18 pm

Flatlander wrote:mes trying to make it sound right, honestly I was just trying to expand upon your post.

Also, responding to Nick,
One great thing I just thought of would be the ability to "Scan" ships for their cargo.

Then the other ship can detect that it is being scanned, and get the hell out of there if they are afraid of losing what they have.

I could imagine doing a mission, and then seeing an alert "Detecting Scan on Your Ship!!!" Then thinking "oh hell, I need to get the hell out of here, I'm not prepared for a PvP battle right now."

Depending on how big areas are and how far away you can see someone before they can shoot you, you could avoid all conflict if you played active enough.


I like that idea, could work really well!

Combat ranges will be unrealistically short, otherwise, its hard to make it fun when you either see your fleet or the enemy fleet and they are miles apart. but some kind of warming that someone is watching you would be very cool.
Nick
User avatar
Suit Battle Armour Commander
 
Posts: 417
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:31 pm
Location: Out to Lunch

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Lord Tyrius » Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:40 pm

Flatlander wrote:I am glad you brought up the example of League of Legends.
[snip]

Let's call this "elo-hell", I imagine everyone being in the same universe will make this less of an issue. However toxic behavior extends to very high elo. (in fact one has little to do with the other, however I realize definition of "toxic" is not clear)
I don't really know where we are going, but I still think we need to strike a balance between what is ok in a game and what is not.

I'm not saying it'll be easy, or that no mistakes are going to be made ever (that's where an appeal system can help), but I can only imagine the levels of **** League of Legends would be without mute/report/sanctions.
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Need anything or have any questions? Drop me a message! (Click)
Follow me on Twitch|YouTube|Twitter
- Cheers!, Tyrius
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Lord Tyrius
User avatar
 
Posts: 2241
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:54 am
Location: Forums Ancient & Developer Meat Shield

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Flatlander » Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:11 pm

Eh, if I had creative control over League of Legends "Toxic Reporting System"

I'd simply give each player a Toxic Rating similar to their Matchmaking ELO.

And the more you get reported for Toxicity the higher your Toxic ELO is, and you'll be more likely to be matched with other Toxic Players.
If you are nice, and never get reported for Toxicity, you'll be matched with other people of the same type.

This way you don't punish people simply because their personality is more confrontational than others.
Flatlander
 
Posts: 77
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 10:09 am

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Sypheria » Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:28 pm

I'd do the same.
Sypheria
User avatar
Universe Architect
 
Posts: 4252
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:23 pm
Location: WinSock.h ln 458 #define AF_UNKNOWN1 20 /*Somebodys using this! */

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Lord Tyrius » Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:32 pm

I see. One thing I want to add to this point: You have to be careful about the impact this mechanism can have. You like to play off-meta? Not performing good? Prepare yourself to be downvoted after the match. No reason, you don't even know they reported you. Next thing you know you are stuck in the "toxic queue".

I think the whole topic is too general and very complex/dynamic. I'm sure sooner or later we will find out to what extend these issues arise, and what can be done about it.
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Need anything or have any questions? Drop me a message! (Click)
Follow me on Twitch|YouTube|Twitter
- Cheers!, Tyrius
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Lord Tyrius
User avatar
 
Posts: 2241
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:54 am
Location: Forums Ancient & Developer Meat Shield

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Sypheria » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:00 pm

It's very easy to determine if a player is playing poorly or intentionally trolling.
Sypheria
User avatar
Universe Architect
 
Posts: 4252
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:23 pm
Location: WinSock.h ln 458 #define AF_UNKNOWN1 20 /*Somebodys using this! */

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Lord Tyrius » Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:32 am

It is for humans. But the system doesn't know if you really were trolling/toxic or if your team blames you and reports you. Offmeta can also get you a lot of reports, and automatic sanction based on it (https://esportsedition.com/league-of-legends/singed-support-banned-meta/)
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Need anything or have any questions? Drop me a message! (Click)
Follow me on Twitch|YouTube|Twitter
- Cheers!, Tyrius
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Lord Tyrius
User avatar
 
Posts: 2241
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:54 am
Location: Forums Ancient & Developer Meat Shield

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Sypheria » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:03 am

No. It actually is very easy for the system to know how much you are contributing to a game. How much of a detriment you are being. What your experience with the game and the current situation is. How you preform regularly in the same experience.
Sypheria
User avatar
Universe Architect
 
Posts: 4252
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:23 pm
Location: WinSock.h ln 458 #define AF_UNKNOWN1 20 /*Somebodys using this! */

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Lord Tyrius » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:13 am

I'm just thinking off the top of my head here, I don't want to get to something specific.
That kind of analysis isn't easy. Reports happen after the game, and stats alone don't mean everything. "He died a lot, so the reports must be genuine" doesn't work. How you measure "contribution" determines what will be punished and what not (so is biased toward certain behaviour). For example the idea of "proxy singed" was to farm minions inside the enemy base, which included dieing so often, that you are not worth any gold anymore to the enemy team. Done correctly, this could mean an advantage for your team, but the system might think you are intentionally feeding, and overall contributing little (in terms of objectives/damage to enemy champoins)
(on the same note, a good player (high contribution), can still be toxic (eg in chat))
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Need anything or have any questions? Drop me a message! (Click)
Follow me on Twitch|YouTube|Twitter
- Cheers!, Tyrius
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Lord Tyrius
User avatar
 
Posts: 2241
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:54 am
Location: Forums Ancient & Developer Meat Shield

Re: Toxic Behavior - What is acceptable behavior in an MMORP

Postby Sypheria » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:23 am

Again, it's still easy to measure contribution verses detriment and long term behavior without any report system at all. Proxy singed has a low detrimental cost and high benefits (High amounts of creeps are dying, his opposition is forced to spend time in the lane, towers are consistently taking damage or falling.). Running down mid to fed has no benefits.

The LoL report system is actually primarily there to give a catharsis release to frustrated players. Players who use it frequently don't have any weight in the system.
Sypheria
User avatar
Universe Architect
 
Posts: 4252
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:23 pm
Location: WinSock.h ln 458 #define AF_UNKNOWN1 20 /*Somebodys using this! */

PreviousNext

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests

cron